CSL update
CSL is totally going hardcore on a new girl in the office, insisting loudly that she needs to go to her church “with people running up and down the aisles and everything”, handing out a pamphlet for her church, and insisting that the new girl needs to pay her tithes every week, even if she thinks she can’t afford it. Hey, we get through this world by persuasion, I get that, but she’s less than six feet from me.
I have to admit that it’s starting to bother me; when she goes on like this, too loud to ignore, I just don’t know what to do, professionally speaking. I feel like if I say something, she’s going to know it’s me – I’m the dude who doesn’t say “bless you” when she sneezes, y’know?
I feel like a line has been crossed. This is different from her talking about her divorce and her children’s problems with the state and all of that awkward ultra-personal info.
Speaking of… In case you’re curious, CSL is somehow and suddenly engaged to be married, in three weeks, to her pastor’s nephew.
Yeah, I don’t know, either.
… I think part of what makes me so hesitant to act is that I don’t want to be a part of making an overly restrictive work environment. I feel lucky that I don’t have to wear a tie, that my boss let’s me screw around a bit as long as I get my work done, and that no one cares if I answer my cell phone at my desk.
But, y’know, if it’s a long conversation, I leave my desk. It seems reasonable, doesn’t it?
So she’s talking to her S.O. on the phone, presumably about who knows, and she’s naming people, and she says “… and SCOTT, who has to listen to me on the phone, *giggle* … oh, I’m just teasing Scott who sits next to me, but he gets into a zone …” Clearly my “I’m not listening to you” vibe is working, but maybe that is working against me, here. I mean, if I seem like I’m totally ignoring anything personal she’s saying, maybe that makes her feel like she’s free to say anything, I don’t know.
What she is doing has got to be as uncomfortable as hell for the new girl (no pun intended…) and if she was talking to me like that, there would definitely be issues that I could only bite my tongue for so long about.
Does CSL have a supervisor you could speak to discreetly? Even if she does suspect you may have said something, how bad would that be?
The other woman is also born again, and I believe does plan on joining her at her church. I don’t believe she is making -her- uncomfortable. Just me.
(I have no idea about anyone around us. I think she takes it down a notch most of the time when the editor is in his “office”. By “office”, I mean he has a full-height cubicle and a door, unlike us.)
Ahh, ok. I was thinking she was just getting blasted out of no where :-p
And as for your additional phone call stuff you just added, I think you should track down / borrow a pair of those super ear protection headsets. Then when she randomly goes to blabbing like she does, pull them out of your drawer and put them on. If nothing else, I’d like to see if you can hold a straight face while doing so… :-p
Ugh. That would drive me insane.
Is there someone a step above you could point this out to who might intervene? Is there any kind of employee handbook that asks you to leave personal issues and/or religion at the door? I agree it’s totally out of line, and unfair to the new person as well. So I think you should do something, but I don’t think you should say/do something directly… good luck!
It’s hostile environment discrimination, if the other person complains.
It doesn’t have to be directed at you for it to be harassment. You can just overhear it and be made uncomfortable. At least it’s that way for sexual harassment.
It’s trickier with the religious stuff. If the other lady’s also into it (and she seems to be, based on additional posts above) then it looks like protected religious speech between two consenting parties and a third party will have a MUCH harder time trying to get traction against it. For him to argue hostile environment as a third party, it would have to be REALLY pervasive and it would probably have to include disparagement of non-believers.
(NOTE: The cases where heavily Christian companies have been nailed for this all involve comments directed at the unbeliever or religious activities where it’s pretty clear, whether explicitly stated or not, that participation is required if you want to advance or stay employed.)
How about racism and political slander? I work in an environment that is hostile to my beliefs in racial equality. (also hostile to non-fascist politics)
I think you’d have a hard time with the racism one. You’re one of the whitest white men I’ve met. (Even if you’re black on the inside.)
Political stuff is almost impossible. I don’t remember seeing any cases on that.
Oh, I figured it would be nearly impossible to do anything.
Being exposed to rampant generic racism and bigotry isn’t really actionable, I’m sure. And as far as I know, it’s perfectly legal to fire someone for their political affiliations.
Two people could really be into talking about someone’s hot ass and both of them are really into the discussion. It would still be harassment to anyone overhearing it even if they weren’t involved or having the said hot ass.
It’s not different. It can be sued for and shouldn’t be happening in the work place. I’ve been requested to not discuss my religion in the work place before. I’ve been told to take down religious material that offended someone. It’s not different.
Let me separate out my responses to some of the things you’re saying:
shouldn’t be happening in the work place
I agree completely. However, I’m answering with an eye toward what is practical to pursue, not what should be practical in an ideal world.
Two people could really be into talking about someone’s hot ass and both of them are really into the discussion. It would still be harassment to anyone overhearing it even if they weren’t involved or having the said hot ass.
It could still be harassment, yes. Generally, one conversation or comment is NOT harassment to a third party who overhears it. A pattern could be, and it could be if the third party asks them to cut it out and they refuse.
It’s not different.
Yes, it is. There’s no protected right to sexual expression based on the First Amendment, but there is a protected right to religious expression. A defendant in a case where two people were voluntarily discussing religion can (and will) assert that those people were simply exercising their “free exercise” rights by sharing their religious faith with each other. There’s no analogous defense for “hot ass” comments.
The existence of the free exercise clause doesn’t mean that religious people are (or should be) completely free to profess their faith all over the workplace, and some employers do indeed make people take religious stuff down or avoid discussing religion. Most don’t, though, unless it’s really causing trouble. (Unfortunately, that usually happens to non-Christians, and it’s a result of religious bigotry rather than a desire for a neutral workplace.)
I’ve been talking about a situation where two of his coworkers are discussing a mutually-held faith in a location where they can be overheard. Obviously, there are other situations where the faiuth thing is so pervasive it would rise to the level of hostile environment discrimination.
For example, if it were more analogous to your “hot ass” example, say that they were talking about how other people in the office were going to burn in hell because they weren’t Christians…